----- Original Message ----- From: Joel R. Helgeson To: tcwug-list at tcwug.org Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 11:28 PM Subject: [TCWUG] They said "NO!" [Was Wireless Bridge, Passive Relay] As you know, I am trying to build a wireless bridge by bouncing the signal off a water tower with two parabolic dishes on top. This setup would require no radio. I had contacted the City of Brooklyn Park to inquire about putting an antenna atop their water tower. They stated that they would take my information and discuss it in a committee meeting. Their response just went to prove that they are truly government employees and not capitalists. They said "No". Plain and simple. They stated that they didn't want private companies putting gear atop their water tower for a bridge link. They stated that if they did, they would then have to offer the same thing to all the other businesses in the area and they just didn't have the real estate atop the tower to support hundreds of bridge relays. (?). I told them that if demand increases, that's when they raise the price as the space became at a premium. I was completely flabbergasted by their response. At no price did they want to give us access. They apparently have no problem giving access to big companies such as cellular carriers and WISP 's, etc, but as far as the private smaller companies are concerned, you're S.O.L. What are your thoughts on this? Are these people dense? I was astounded by their decision. They stated that if I wanted to appeal the decision, I could take it to the City Council where I would have to explain to these people what a wireless bridge is as they come up with irrelevant arguments regarding their concerns about it interfering with their cellular phone or how it will impact homeland security. Can you believe this?! Joel R. Helgeson Director of Networking & Security Services SymetriQ Corporation, www.symetriq.com 8500 Normandale Lake Boulevard, Suite 1670 Bloomington, Minnesota 55437-3813 Office: (952) 921-8869 Cell: (651) 270-7521 "An investment in knowledge pays the best dividends." - Benjamin Franklin They're smart, on a few counts. Number 1: Insurance. The big WISPs/cell/radio people can afford to pay off the insurance companies if you fall off the 100 foot water tower. Number 2: i'm sure they get inspected by many authorities every year making sure they're within compliance of the numerous mandates set by FCC, and local/state gov't. Number 3: "we don't want private companies using it". Simply put, if they let you, then other people would petition them to do the same thing. It becomes more a hastle than it's worth at the weekly/monthly meetings. Even though you think that putting 2 parabolic dishes atop a water tower seems harmless enough, it's just another lightning rod to them, with potential to damage property. Even though there's no radios up there to generate a signal, you're still putting RF through them, which can, if not aimed properly, bounce through grandma's living room, screwing up her heart monitor system. A risk i'm sure the local health board would love to talk to you about. :) There's so many other factors involved in just simply "putting up a dish". On the other hand, i'm sure many local governments would love a bit of extra income to pay the bills, which confuses me at times. I know of a few people who've worked on water towers, and the towns they're in (*cough matt hallacy cough*) love the fact that they can provide this service to their townspeople. But in the TC area, wireless is now becomming a touchy subject. Lots of people getting into trouble warchalking/driving, and other seemingly harmless things. So, from their perspective, i can understand. It's just simply a liability at this point in the game. Having worked at a college radio station for the past 3 months, and installing obscene antennas atop the Sherburne Hall roof (tallest building between mpls and fargo), and having wap11's get nailed by lightning, it's not fun. I've installed my 24dBi dish on top the roof here at SCSU, aimed at the local WISP, when i installed it (it's for the radio station's webcast, for those who must know) the local people wanted to know what it was, was it a danger, was it gonna mess with KARE-11's camera, was it gonna mess with the FBI tower, was it gonna mess with the airport, etc etc. I had to write to the school commissions that it was in fact installed properly, and not a danger to anything else up there. It's not a pretty process to go through. (the hardest people to convince that it was fine was the FBI. They're not too keen on having it 60 feet away from their only relay radio in central MN) Having said that, i'd suggest calling the local co-op, i'm sure there's somthing tall around there that's rentable for a semi-cheap price. Talk to Matt Hallacy on that one, since the WISP he used to work for was housed off the top of a grain elevator. Just my $.02 -- Alex Hartman - goober at goobe.net - Asst. Engineer KVSC-FM PGP Key fingerprint = 26 41 19 56 19 81 E2 BC EE C8 1D F4 DB B8 ED B8 "Educational, public radio, 88.1 FM KVSC - St. Cloud"